First reactions. Telephone interview, October 2024

“True, genuine, inclusive democracy matters, very clearly”

Simon Johnson learnt of the award from the congratulatory text messages piling-up on his phone. In this short conversation, recorded just moments after he had heard the news, he highlights the importance of participatory decision-making in making the most of human potential.

Interview transcript

Simon Johnson: Hello?

Adam Smith: Oh, hello, am I speaking with Simon Johnson?

SJ: Yes.

AS: Hi, my name is Adam Smith. Presumably you’ve heard the news just announced in Stockholm a few minutes ago,

SJ: A few minutes ago. Yes. I didn’t hear from the academy. I just saw text messages from people congratulating me, which is an interesting way to learn.

AS: Well, may I add my congratulations.

SJ: Thank you.

AS: I suppose one has to ask what your first thoughts are on being awarded the prize?

SJ: I’m surprised and delighted.

AS: The committee highlighted the link between the setting up of inclusive political institutions and prosperity. Does your work point to a way out of poverty for the poorest nations, do you think?

SJ: Well, and that’s certainly something we’ve worked on a lot and tried to answer. I don’t think there are any easy answers because so much of that poverty is unfortunately the result of longstanding institutional arrangements, political and economic. So there are some very big burdens to overcome.

AS: Sticking with this inclusiveness, your recent work that you’ve published together with, Daron Acemoglu, the book from last year, Power and Progress, on who controls technology and who benefits from it, seems to point in the same direction. That one key to getting things right is to make sure that institutions of participatory and that the way that we approach technology has to be participatory. Is that true to say?

SJ: Yes. I think we see that book as exactly developing that theme. And I think you put it very well. Controlling technology, particularly if you’re talking about and thinking about new technology, technology at the frontier, who makes those decisions is very important. It reflects inclusivity, and can affect it as well.

AS: I suppose it all hinges around the idea of letting humans flourish to their best extent, talent being spread so broadly around, it’s good to let it flourish everywhere.

SJ: Yes. I think that’s a very good way of saying it. I think a way Adam Smith – the original Adam Smith – might have said it.

AS: I suppose another potential reading of your work is that democracy matters, and I suppose that is a message which people might find particularly important to the moment, given the threats to democracy that people perceive around the world.

SJ: Yes, absolutely. Democracy, true, genuine, inclusive democracy matters very clearly.

AS: I think we’ll let you deal with your day, which is, I know, going to be impossible. Congratulations.

SJ: Thank you.

AS: Thank you. Bye.

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